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Addition of Chest Shops Plugin to the RLCrafter's Land Server


Voidic_Fang
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I'd like to suggest the addition of the chest shops plugin to the server economy. I, and several other players have talked about it, and we are willing to even pay for it's implementation.

I think the pros would be:
It would make it less difficult to sell bulk resources and low value items in general. There is a big problem on the server where you can't sell or buy anything during the early or mid-game because people only post extremely valuable items to the market. It essentially locks you out of trade during the first half of your entire levelling process unless you spam the chat asking for the resource you want to trade.

Players want and are already trying to have roleplayed in-person shops where they trade items while present in-person. These shops are also receiving support from the players. It's likely that with chest shops added, the server would have a lot more of this activity, which would be good for the game and increase the player-base.

Reduce Server Resource Usage - If common shop area is set by mods;

Here's an honest listing of the possible cons including things other players have brought up:

Land usage near spawn - If common shop area is set by mods; This really isn't a big deal, there are unclaimed areas near spawn as I speak and there is a large area around spawn that is claimed by mods and unused.

People could pvp in the shops against server rules - Now this is a good concern, there is currently a bug on the rlcraft server that allows pvp in non-pvp areas and people could kill in shops as purchases were being made. My rebuttal would be that every time I saw someone pk, they were caught by staff because the players online are good at reporting when someone kills at spawn.

Adding the Plugin, Obviously - Putting stress on the already overworked server devs may prevent other issues from being addressed, like the pvp in protected areas bug I mentioned earlier.

All of this being said, I think it would be a net positive for the server if chest shops plugin was added, it would give players a reason to explore each other's builds and would help people in the mid/early game get involved in the market, instead of just the ultra-rare late game things being sold at the moment.

If you're reading this and you want to add anything, feel free to leave a comment and I'll try to get your input on one of the lists ASAP.

If you're a dev, let me know if you think it's a good idea or not and whether or not it can be implemented.


Thanks all,

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After reading the post from @Voidic_Fangwhich we read with joy,we cannot add any further plugins.

The following reasons for that are:

1) market scams would be way more common,

2) the buy system would be hard to monitor and trace

3) and would essentialy ruin the server's economy even more quickly.

Although, there are some good news! 

 

 

This topic is an excellent example of how we should further reorganise the existent buy shop at spawn. The current one is pretty outdated, the prices are overrated and there is lots of room for potential. There is a whole basement that doesn't serve nothing currently that's located in spawn, so we could make a new shop there in the near future.

Also, why implement a new plugin when the existing /market works quite well, and functions quite well? 

We enjoy seeing suggestions like these because it shows us the player's interest in the servers growth!

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You blocked me on Discord when you either couldn't or wouldn't answer any of my questions/concerns
So I'm going to go ahead and repost them here along with a breakdown of your points.

It would make it less difficult to sell bulk resources and low value items in general. There is a big problem on the server where you can't sell or buy anything during the early or mid-game because people only post extremely valuable items to the market. It essentially locks you out of trade during the first half of your entire levelling process unless you spam the chat asking for the resource you want to trade.

-This is wrong, currently people only buy or sell the late game items because nobody buys the midgame items, as a person who LITERALLY every day posts things on the market I finally just stopped putting mid level items on because they didn't sell, it's to easy to run into a tower and loot a few chests while ignoring the mobs and get mid tier gear while not having enough money to afford to purchase it. I regularly sell iron enchanted and chain enchanted gear for 5$ an item. I've never sold one. People don't have money in the game and having more stores isn't going to solve this. I have literally offered jobs and work at a wage to people and only once did I ever have any takers. Players want things the easy way and aren't willing to commit time to making money. Point in case, I offer 5$ a stack of cobble and stone, things your digging anyway. The only person who ever put any on the market was Lia, one time, something like six stacks.

-How do you make sure that stores are stocked regularly there's nothing worse then going through 15 stores and finding them all empty just trying to find an item you want. This is actually a thing I've encountered. How do you actually find the store that has the item your looking for?


Players want and are already trying to have roleplayed in-person shops where they trade items while present in-person. These shops are also receiving support from the players. It's likely that with chest shops added, the server would have a lot more of this activity, which would be good for the game and increase the player-base.

-This is wrong, there are very few people who want to physically run a shop and there is nothing in the system currently implemented that would prevent or stop this in any way, in fact having signs that sell for you would just make more automated shops. Which at the end of the day are no different then the /market we currently have.

-Do you want to be the guy who worked really hard on your store and it looks nice and the plot next to you is three chests with a sign? Be prepared for that because I've seen it to.


Reduce Server Resource Usage - If common shop area is set by mods;

-This is completely false unless that area is set up in another dimension. Any area of the game that has players in it takes server resources and if it it running scripts then it takes more resources then a place with none (ie. the currently existing Destiny tavern). On top of which lots of theses scripts running at once in a small area causes increased server usage whether being interacted with or not. The only way to avoid this is to either dedicate another server to the area specifically or to put it in an unused area of the game (each segment of the game runs independent, the end, the overworld, the nether) you would need to come up with a fourth that is not linked to any of the rest and then it would be using all the resources the others use the moment one person was in it.

-The more stores you have in the area running the script the more lag is on the entire server and the only time those scripts aren't running is when nobody is in that alternate dimension (You can see this currently by going through the portal to the end at spawn, some of those rotten flesh on the other side have been there for weeks as long as nobody is in the end it doesn't update and the items don't get lag cleared).

-If we did set aside another area specifically for stores, what if you want a larger area then your neighbor? What if you have more to sell then your able to fit in your plot? What if you decide to go in with another player and they lock you out of your stuff (we literally had this happen two weeks ago with a pair of good friends and it was a huge drama fest)



Land usage near spawn - If common shop area is set by mods; This really isn't a big deal, there are unclaimed areas near spawn as I speak and there is a large area around spawn that is claimed by mods and unused

-This is true but the areas around spawn that ARE being used at ugly as heck and tend to consist of peoples various farms, such as the massive villager farm directly outside spawn or the second one forty blocks further on.


-Any land claim area set aside for stores becomes unwieldy and problematic for many reasons, how long does your store remain active? What if I get a prime spot and never actually stock it? It's mine I got it it's my choice on how to use it. What happens to a persons store or anything left in it when somebody has actually left the server? This would lead to initially a lot of people doing something with the area but then a wasteland as people came and left the server, one of the first things people would do is set up a shop but when their stuff didn't sell they would move on to another server. I've seen this before. What happens if you leave the server and are gone for a week or two and people think your gone or want your plot and say your not coming back and you do? Or even worse what happens if all your stuff is gone because your claim legitimately ran up and you come back, what if you've been gone for a legitimate reason like a death in the family?

-There are various way claims can be griefed and Destiny can attest to some of this as she's been dealing with it for at least the last two weeks that I'm aware of from people claiming land in the middle of her town, to selling claim plots due to them being prime real estate. Short of having a GM come online to watch all this stuff every day I don't see this one as avoidable, which on it's own is a problem as our current system runs almost completely independently of gms and doesn't need any overwatch or extra work from them.

-Having to go from store to store to find the cheapest copy of the item I want is a huge PITA. Currently all the copies of the item I want are easy to find on the /market.

 

People could pvp in the shops against server rules - Now this is a good concern, there is currently a bug on the rlcraft server that allows pvp in non-pvp areas and people could kill in shops as purchases were being made. My rebuttal would be that every time I saw someone pk, they were caught by staff because the players online are good at reporting when someone kills at spawn.

-Players are awful at reporting it, when they do they do it improperly and just post it in discord and 90% of the time don't take screenshots. Reports against players are to be done in the forums related to it. Often when it is done it's not actually dealt with in a timely manner because mods are not online 100% of the time (er mah gerd they humons?!?) and the person who was ganked loses their stuff anyway, as a player who was ganked several times upon joining the server for the first time I can say losing your already meager things to a ganker is very disheartening, I never did get my stuff back but by the time it was addressed and I was offered it back I had already progressed beyond that point and simply chalked it up to a learning experience.

-Then there is the issue of what is to prevent people from making shops that just kill you and collect your equipment? I myself like to use hidden redstone doors and have had complaints in the past that due to server tick and individuals lagging people have suffocated in my doors and that's completely accidental and not under my control at all, even setting up a three second delay people still somehow died in it.

 


-This is all assuming you can get people to use their claim blocks to even make a store as two of the most common questions I see is "How do you get more claim blocks" and "How do I make a claim". Even walking people through that second one step by step can be a PITA. The issue linked to this is of course every time a person lost something due to their own negligence it would require GM intervention to fix causing them to have to have a greater presence and work load.

-Currently the number of marketable items is linked directly related to your rank, this promotes people donating to the server and all of us getting to play, if your after more market slots there is literally a 2$ option to just gave infinite market slots. Also as a person who has bought this particular option how would giving away all the market slots for free work? Should I get a refund? What about the dozens of people who have no doubt bought it in the past who don't play? How much money would giving those refunds cost the server? Should these people get something in lieu? If so what? How do you contact them to let them know that the item they purchased has changed (which is actually legally required in some countries and could be an issue if some dick wanted to press it).

-Who would this change alienate and cause to leave the server? I personally left a server because the server owner wanted to honor me and put a warp near my base (I'm a fairly private guy and you rarely see me share a visit to my base). Another example is the guy who was banned for duping earlier this week, he was a player from before the last wipe and he was mad because of the changes to TNT blocks and kept going on about it.

-Having more mods running makes the server laggier and more prone to crashing as the various mods interact, as a person who heavily mods his games I can tell you that you really have to be careful especially when two mods interact with the same item in a game.


-This already exists in the form of Destiny's town, a place for player run shops, it has a waystone which literally works better then warps because players choose where they want their warps to and whether they want one in the first place.

-Giving a central hub area is begging for griefing that fact is that griefers don't care, they come onto the server knowing full well this is what they are here to do, do as much damage as they can and move on. They have nothing to lose and no reason not to do it. A central area allows them to grief more people faster.

-Our current system of /market offers everything your asking for except literally having a counter and that's easily fixable as seen by Destiny. It feels more like you want to force people to come see your build then anything as you refuse to actually address any of my points. On top of which forcing people to go to a certain place to buy things doesn't actually add anything to the game and in fact takes away from our current system which is accessable literally anywhere, got to much loot from the tower? /market and clean your inventory, heck want it but don't want to warp home or actually sell it? Use the /market as storage and price the item at 3mill. Need some extra blocks for your build (not that anybody other then me has sold a block on the market in the month that I've been on other then me) /market. Want to trade another player an item but don't want to go to them? /market. Want to safely trade an item to or from a player you don't know or don't trust? /market has you covered.

-Our current system of warps via /homes is a much more robust system especially as like market slots you get more as you donate it promotes giving to the server to allow it to continue to exist. In fact with exception of a market, the end, the nether, and spawn I have yet to figure out anywhere that could possibly use a warp point. Warp points essentially become another spawn that people come out from to start in the wilds and honestly I thing the random teleport option does a better job at this as it prevents claim sprawl.

-I don't see what the proposed system actually adds to the game that our current system does not already have. I've asked several times for one example of anything where it adds to the game and doesn't take away from it. Instead of answering you repeatedly chose to ignore the question. So I ask again, why. What does it add.

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i belive a user called kevin asked about this awhile back on dw20 1.12 he made his own shop wit open computers and everything, and was asking if there was a way for it to work and they denied it i belive his gone on to other places now and his shop script is working there with out issues currently

 

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