Limiting Certain Blocks and Creations

[Spring_Water]

It may be worth a note, that we have frequent server crashes on CraftersLand Tekkit due to complex, intensive creations brought on by those who wish to have it all. These individuals dream big and never stop making it bigger - I am guilty of this too. There is nothing wrong with this philosophy, except when the server crashes. 

 

In an example, fulmination generators and laser drills/prechargers in clear excess can become detriment to the server's stability. Limiting blocks and creations like these could prove beneficial for preventing crashes. Instead of 3 fulmination generators, limit each individual to 1, etc. Items like laser drills/prechargers, tesseracts, item ducts, and other common blocks that are over used per chunk in excess can take away from users' experience by constant server kicks. 

 

A solution to this issue could simply be adding to the server rules. You would not need to regulate this by creepily monitoring individuals like Big Brother from George Orwell's novel 1984, but rather if a server crash occurs and the problem was due to an excess of a limited item, a consequence would follow.

 

I know this may get flak from individuals who are in the "end-game" like myself, but it may be worth consideration. 

 

Let me know your thoughts

- Spring

 

 

 

 

[Swimsam1]

I think thats a terrible idea. 8 months is a long time for a wipe and we’re doing just fine

[Swimsam1]

also your talking about tesseracts very useful blocks. itemducts you can limit that

[Spring_Water]

23 minutes ago, Swimsam777 said:

I think thats a terrible idea. 8 months is a long time for a wipe and we’re doing just fine

This is not a very useful comment, constructive criticisms are what I am looking for. Tell me why it is a terrible idea, not that it is.

 

 

18 minutes ago, Swimsam777 said:

also your talking about tesseracts very useful blocks. itemducts you can limit that

Tesseracts are useful, and this is why they are over used in abundance. They are also a main cause for crash loops, but that is a different topic for a different time. I am not saying remove them from the server, merely limit them. Do you need 300 tesseracts? Would 200 change your gameplay experience?.. etc..

 

I appreciate your opinion either way.

-Spring

 

 

[Henk]

I didn’t think I would be saying this, but I agree with swimsam.

Modded is an unstable place, and we can’t just restrict any item that has a risk of becoming corrupt and crashing the server. Heck, any block or item can become corrupt.

 

And for the record, it’s not always huge 300ish tesseracts machines that become corrupt.

And I don’t think it would be practical or even work if we per say would have a rule against placing more than X blocks of item Y.

Because while it is kind of sad, most players don’t pay much attentions to the rules and mostly just assume it’s common sense stuff- which for the majority it is.

So having something - excuse me - absurd like this in the rules would mean it would get missed by so many.

 

It’s as if instead changed our current restrictedItems plugin to no longer remove banned items that appear in your inventory and also tell you about it. But instead you would be punished for owning it, it wouldn’t be practical and the players would hate it.

 

And if the only purpose of doing this would be to prolong the wipe cycle to something like 8-9 montjs instead of 6, then I would also disagree with that. I think 6 months is a perfectly fine lenght of time for a wipe, as by that time we actually have players almost begging for a wipe. Not because of any instability, but more so because they feel ”done” and want to start over.

 

Sure, what you are suggesting could technically work if we would make a custom plugin limit you to certain amounts of blocks. Like we have for chunkloaders, but it’s far from perfect and has a few ways of getting around it. And people would try to get around it. It is also a lot more effort than it’s worth- as i mentioned earlier, just overall decreasing wouldn’t do a whole lot to prevent this issue. Sure, less would mean slightly less crahses, but usually the issue isn’t - for example, the tesseract - the tesseracts fault. It doesn’t have to be anyone’s fault, or anyTHING’s fault.

[Spring_Water]

I appreciate both of your inputs on this thread. As Swimsam said, tesseracts are a very useful block, and I will be one of the first ones encouraging their use. Without shooting myself in the foot to sort of speak, it's people like me that cause instability on the servers through excessive strain. On the contrary, Henk you stated it best:

 

4 hours ago, Henk said:

And for the record, it’s not always huge 300ish tesseracts machines that become corrupt.

 

I fail to assume the broader reality that a large sum of crash loops are due to a single corrupt block.

 

 

4 hours ago, Henk said:

And if the only purpose of doing this would be to prolong the wipe cycle to something like 8-9 montjs instead of 6, then I would also disagree with that. I think 6 months is a perfectly fine lenght of time for a wipe, as by that time we actually have players almost begging for a wipe. Not because of any instability, but more so because they feel ”done” and want to start over.

 

I don't mean to push for an extended 9 month server wipe, but rather tone down the spontaneous server crashes that may be preventable, if even preventable. I agree with the statement in reference to 6 months being perfect timing for a wipe, for identical reasons why.

 

 

4 hours ago, Henk said:

Sure, what you are suggesting could technically work if we would make a custom plugin limit you to certain amounts of blocks. Like we have for chunkloaders, but it’s far from perfect and has a few ways of getting around it. And people would try to get around it. 

 

As you said, people don't follow the rules. I wish they did. I did not anticipate that a plugin would be more efficient for matters like this, and for that reason my rule idea would be - to blatantly say - pretty dumb. Enforcement would need to be dependent on another plugin, which may not prove the best use of time when staff could be delegating this to server maintenance.

 

I do think there is some merit to this conversation however. Limiting server crashes by preventing overloaded server situations could prove beneficial, but as of right now I cannot see a solution that everyone would like. To go even further, preventing block corruption would be the end goal obviously. But, this is clearly an impossible, unattainable task as we know. In the end modded servers are buggy, crash frequently, and push RAM beyond its expectations for Minecraft and that's just a part of what we all signed on for. Thank you both for the dialogue, I had interesting thoughts and a ideas from it. Until next time - Spring

[Swimsam1]

I didn’t mean to be rude. Hate was a strong word. tesseracts were an example. not my only point. sorry for any confusion 

[EPICfighters]

For the Fulmination Generators, I do agree that 1 is plenty as it provides a huge amount of power. I would just like to mention that redstone energy conduits would be best to use as they are much more stable and are less likely to cause a crash.

[GravityCube]

Maybe ban aluminum wires can be a good thing.

[Swimsam1]

we shouldn’t be looking for excuses to ban more items. the less banned items the more people the server attracts. and we have quite a few already. 

[Spring_Water]

I do know years ago that aluminum wires when hooked up to tesseracts can cause server crashes almost immediately. I am not sure if this is still the case as I do not follow changelogs consistently, as a matter of fact I’m sure it’s not.

 

Cutting back on server lag in any way I also see being beneficial to current players as well as attracting new comers, and my idea of reducing/limiting certain blocks was just a thought.

 

I appreciate the input from everyone and can’t wait to hear from others.

 

-Spring

[GravityCube]

From the player side is hard to make big changes in the server, we don’t even have access to the server logs to see what’s wrong or a list of the actual items that crash the server to say what do we think about it. It’s common sense to hide the crash causes to avoid bad intentioned players actions.

I think that improvement in the server can be done by focusing a dev on fixing or patching the issues.

We instead can report the issues that we find and ask for features that we would like. Maybe you think that some things aren’t posible but they are almost always to hard to accomplish but if the staff sees that is something that ppl are really interest on they are probably going to make an effort.

 

This is just an opinion, it’s like what I think about the suggestion section of the forums.

PD: I’m not very experienced speaking english so I would appreciate any correction.

[Archmaestro]

On 1/16/2019 at 5:18 PM, Spring_Water said:

Instead of 3 fulmination generators, limit each individual to 1, etc. 

This is a terrible idea. The server turns blocks that cause lag into obsidian. Making additional infrastructure is just asking for abuse and angry players.

 

On 1/17/2019 at 4:03 PM, EPICfighters said:

For the Fulmination Generators, I do agree that 1 is plenty as it provides a huge amount of power. I would just like to mention that redstone energy conduits would be best to use as they are much more stable and are less likely to cause a crash.

One fulmination block will store enough energy to make 8884 obsidian with a non-glitched lava fabricator. Limiting the possession to one block is a severe and unusual limitation. 

 

Redstone energy conduits are far superior when used on a fulmination generator. I did some experimenting and the cause of the lag was indeed the aluminum wires. As soon as I replaced them, the lag stopped. 

[EPICfighters]

By one, I mean one structure not one individual block.

 

I typically do a 5x5x5 hollow structure.

[Spring_Water]

I am referring to the same meaning as Epic here. One 7x7x7 checkered structure is completely capable for all of my needs, as I'm sure it is for anyone's.

 

Redstone energy conduits are significantly better than the aluminum wires when it comes to server lag. I think this is common ground.

[Infernal]

I hate this fucking bullshit. How could you advocate for restrictions on the items that give players power. How about instead of that we give admins the power to fix the server. I know GM is a very high rank and I keep hearing the words "we cant do that" from them. SO instead of trying to make players be less creative how about we empower our staff to help players? 

[GravityCube]

What are you talking about? They just want some items that crash the server to be banned or restricted for everyone to enjoy the server without crashes too often.

The aluminum wire + tesseract crash was fixed. I think that this topic should be closed.

[Infernal]

6 hours ago, GravityCube said:

What are you talking about? They just want some items that crash the server to be banned or restricted for everyone to enjoy the server without crashes too often.

The aluminum wire + tesseract crash was fixed. I think that this topic should be closed.

Dude can you read? 
Look at original post

[GravityCube]

8 hours ago, Infernal said:

Dude can you read? 
Look at original post

All of the problems that he said were because of the tesseract issue. They don’t crash/lag the server by themself.

[Infernal]

6 hours ago, GravityCube said:

All of the problems that he said were because of the tesseract issue. They don’t crash/lag the server by themself.

No, and they do lag the server. That lag is an acceptable cost and people should accept it instead of limit people's creativity.